Saturday, May 31, 2003

Thatcher

Just So You Know

Had Thatcher’s Tory government made alternate arrangements for workers and miners that would have eased their transition. But they were pretty much just out on the street. It doesn’t make much sense to solve high unemployment problems by creating more unemployment. As to Thatcher overhauling Britain and improving its economy, historian Kenneth O. Morgan, in The Oxford History of Britain (Oxford: Oxford University Press, 1993) argues that while Thatcher’s policy did introduce some recovery to Britain’s economy in the early 1980s, the economy tanked again in the late 1980s after a decade or so of Thatcherism. According to Morgan,

“Most serious of all [difficulties], the apparent revival in the economy began to lose credibility. The tax-cutting policy of the Chancellor, Nigel Lawson, was now seen to have led to a huge balance of payments deficit, at 20 billion pounds the worst figure on record. Unemployment rose sharply and the pound came under pressure. Worse still, the conquest of inflation, the government’s main boast, was now threatened by a consumer-credit and spending boom. Bank rate soared to 15 per cent, and the impact was felt by every mortgaged home-owner in the land” (Morgan 660). [Note: I tried to block this appropriately but can’t figure out how. Apologies.]


Posted by Mike on 05/31/03 at 07:58 PM
Just So You KnowPermalink

Class War

Partisan Politics

Correct. The masses never got behind a global class war/revolution, or even in Imperial Russia. The Marxist prophecy never materialized. It didn’t happen. Marx prophesied that the vanguard of the proletariat would initiate the class war and the rest of the proletariat would quickly follow. That did not occur. As far as I know, Jesus hasn’t shown up again either. The Marxist prophecy will never happen because the world changed significantly after the mid-nineteenth century, and no, the workers never got behind it, nor will they ever.

The United States does have a class system, but as you indicated it is what the sociologists call an open stratification system. Well, even a broken clock is right twice a day so the sociology folks were bound to get something right thanks to law of averages. But still. Just because mobility is possible between classes it does not mean the classes do not exist. They are fluid, but they are there. Upward and downward mobility is possible, people can go from working to middle to upper and back down to working again. But at every step, there is a step. A permanent social structure is called a caste system. That’s when the social ladder is entirely hereditary and is also known as a closed stratification system where no mobility is possible.

In the United States, classes are based entirely upon wealth and education. There is no hereditary aristocracy, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t have a class structure. See, in Britain and much of Europe, with the industrial revolution, the hereditary aristocracy constituted the upper class, non-titled wealthy and well-to-do educated professionals, shopkeepers, etc. constituted the middle, urban and rural workers the working class. With the industrial revolution, Britain and Europe moved from a caste to a class social structure when mobility became possible between the working and middle classes. Not guaranteed, no, but possible. Hell, some people in the middle class even bought themselves a title to move into the aristocracy. Thus, it is mobility that distinguishes a class from a caste structure, and the United States holds the possiblity fo mobility, be it upward or downward. My terminology in describing the United States as a nation with a class structure was correct.


Posted by Mike on 05/31/03 at 07:19 PM
Partisan PoliticsPermalink

Friday, May 30, 2003

On defenders of freedom

Partisan Politics

No one’s perfect, sure. And you know that despite my anglophilia, I have always said that British policy in Ireland has been reprehensible for 800 straight years. It is the primary exception to Britain’s largely positive impact on history in general. It is a black stain, in fact. No British leader, it seems, from the Plantagenets, to Cromwell, to Churchill, to Thatcher can ever think clearly or morally about Ireland. Granted.

But as for her activities outside Ireland, I must disagree. Britain’s economy in the seventies was in even worse shape than in the United States. Industries nationalized by Labor governments after the Second World War were hemorrhaging taxpayer money, unemployment was high, inflation was high, things were generally shitty. The worst offender of the nationalized industries was the coal industry. The government was throwing hundreds of millions of pounds down the hole every year, maintaining mines and pits that could not ever make money. If you owned something that was losing you a third of your income a year, would you want to keep it? Thatcher’s government closed unprofitable mills. What any sensible business owner would do. And, they sold off all the other industries – rail, steel, oil, the lot of them. It isn’t government’s job to run businesses.


Posted by Buckethead on 05/30/03 at 09:29 PM
Partisan PoliticsPermalink

How is it a class war

Partisan Politics

When the vaguard of the proletariat is doing the fighting? The masses don’t seem very interested. And, what is this class structure you speak of? We have a capitalist economy, true (yea capitalism!) but there are no permanent classes. The vast majority of millionaires in this country are nouveau riche, from working or middle class families, not from the already rich. My grandfather’s family was dirt poor, he hunted squirrels to put meat on the table, and was a hobo in the thirties. But he went into real estate, got reasonably rich, and retired to a brick Georgian mansion in Guernsey county, Ohio. His wife’s father was a union organizer, worked with the commie John L. Lewis. Most of the poor in this country (lowest quintile of earnings) are not poor ten years later. Poverty in this country is more a matter of timing than anything else. I was poor, now I’m not. I hope to be rich. I am not the member of any permanent class. Nor is anyone else. We have no landed aristocracy, or hereditary rulers. Anyone can become rich, or president.


Posted by Buckethead on 05/30/03 at 08:48 PM
Partisan PoliticsPermalink

Taxes and the economy

Filthy Lucre

Johno, $4.50 x 280,000,000 = 1.26 billion dollars. That is a lot. The thing is, when you leave the money in the pockets of the people that earned it, instead of giving it to Ted Kennedy, they will use it for many different things. Some will buy beer and pizza. Some will collect stamps. Some will go out for cheap hookers. Others will save it, and invest it. Still other people will take the money that was invested, and give it to some yahoo with a too-clever idea for vacuum-powered hair cutting devices. That guy will hire people to manufacture and sell it. If some money is left over from beer and pizza, stamps or hookers, they will buy it. The economy has just grown. There is more wealth in the system. The new company will pay taxes. So will the formerly unemployed welfare mothers making the doohickeys, and the sleazeballs hawking them on infomercials at three in the morning. So revenue goes up. And as long as we maintain a sound fiscal policy, a low rate of inflation will be the result. This is a good thing. If some people aren’t as rich as the new Vacuum Hair Cutter magnate, that’s because they didn’t go out and found their own company, which anybody with sufficient gumption can do. It’s all about liberty.


Posted by Buckethead on 05/30/03 at 08:39 PM
Filthy LucrePermalink

Space News

That Buck Rogers Stuff

Some people are waking up to two things – that the Chinese are serious in their space aims, and that the private drive for space is stronger than it has ever been. Within a year, we will almost certainly see the Chinese become the third nation to send a man into space, and also a winner of the x-prize for the first civilian team to fly twice above the atmosphere in the same vehicle in a week’s time.

The Washington Times has a new report on Chinese space activities. Some time ago, the Chinese announced their plan to set up a Lunar outpost within a decade. As the article relates, the Chinese are moving steadily towards their goal. EVA Training and dependable, simple Russian space technology indicate that they are intending more than simple orbital publicity stunts. In response, India has also announced a Lunar program, and the Japanese may follow. Remarkably, the Japanese source believes that the Chinese will be on the moon within three or four years.


Posted by Buckethead on 05/30/03 at 08:22 PM
That Buck Rogers StuffPermalink

Would an Orthodox Marxist

Partisan Politics

Have to hate America, or at least agitate for its overthrow?


Posted by Buckethead on 05/30/03 at 07:41 PM
Partisan PoliticsPermalink

Of course,

Just So You Know

The working classes that you correctly say constitute the majority of the military are also reliably the most patriotic segment of American society, and have always been. The academic and chattering classes are the only ones liable, as a group, to throw down their rifles like the French. The aims of actual members of the working class have rarely been what leftists always insist that they have to be.

I wasn’t imputing that you said Anti-Irishism was widespread, merely saying that that was the first I’ve heard of it.


Posted by Buckethead on 05/30/03 at 07:40 PM
Just So You KnowPermalink

What I believe: Taxes

Filthy Lucre

To go a little further on the tax issue, here it is:

Axiom A: The current tax code is a kafkian horror.

Axiom Two: People should be treated equally and fairly under the law.

Axiom III: a taxation scheme should have only two objects, to provide reasonable revenue for government functions, and not to impede the functioning of the economy or for social engineering.

Axiom N: a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds.


Posted by Buckethead on 05/30/03 at 07:30 PM
Filthy LucrePermalink

Catharsis

Just So You Know

John writes, “I still want to know how Mike resolves Marxist orthodoxy with an evident love of the United States and its ways ...”

Easy. I’m not an Orthodox Marxist. I’m not really a Marxist for that matter. I use it when applicable to historical circumstances.


Posted by Mike on 05/30/03 at 07:02 PM
Just So You KnowPermalink

Villification

Perfidy Attacks

Buckethead writes,

“If American historians hate and villify the Irish Americans, they are the only ones doing it. I haven’t noticed any anti-Irish bigotry in the wider world.”

Yeah. No shit. I never accused the wider world of anti-Irish bigotry. I wrote precisely: “That’s just one more way for American historians to criticize Irish-Americans, easily the most hated and villified ethnic group in American ethnic historiography over the last 40 years.” This is an old ethnic animosity maintained exclusively within the Ivory Tower.

As to the rich man’s war/poor man’s fight issue, your argument is that that’s the way those things are done. Sure, it’s the way of the world. But if we all collectively shrug our shoulders and say, “oh well that’s how it is,” we’ll never see any changes. No, we can’t put old rich men in trenches. But how about their children? They don’t serve. What if they had to? What if the working class, that has historically constituted much of the American military, threw down their rifles and said, “fight your own damn war.”

Of course this is an historical issue as opposed to a present issue. With the professionalization of the American military class issues are becoming less acute. The military itself is becoming an opportunity for upward mobility once service is complete. They aren’t paid very much while serving, but there are opportunities for education and the acquisition of skills. So the rich man’s war and poor man’s fight might be evolving into a non-issue.


Posted by Mike on 05/30/03 at 07:00 PM
Perfidy AttacksPermalink

On Heroes, Taxes, and Fast Driving

Partisan Politics

Buckethead, dude, I think he’s got you on Thatcher. Whatta beast.

Mike is correct in pointing out that all heroes have feet of clay, but I’m gonna poke, poke, poke, at the hornets’ nest by claiming that Reagan and Thatcher won the cold war exactly because they forced the USSR to stop, think, check their wallets, and put the brakes to what Stalin had set rolling. Also, it doesn’t hurt that Gorbachev was a second-generation Party member, the first Premier without direct ties to the Revolution.

But let’s not bicker and argue about who killed who! I still want to know how Mike resolves Marxist orthodoxy with an evident love of the United States and its ways, and what sages Buckethead is consulting to assert that tax cuts dependably spur the economy (you’re not allowed to mention Larry Kudlow).

On that last point, I’m not sure that an extra $4.50 in people’s pockets is particularly meaningful for the economy, except for convenience stores, pizza shops and breweries. I’d like to think that the Average American does think of tax cuts as something they can count on, but I’m not so sure. That presupposes that the Average American acts rationally in economic matters, and I have always found that assumption laughable.

Finally, the discussion of the current tax cuts has to eventually come around to the question of massive deficit spending. Where’s the wall, how fast are we going, and how long til we hit it? There’s a war on, you know.


Posted by Johno on 05/30/03 at 06:44 PM
Partisan PoliticsPermalink

Thatcher in spandex? Agggghhh! I’m blind!

Just So You Know

Steve, I’m going to quibble with your statement that Reagan, Thatcher, Roosevelt, and Churchill were superhero defenders of freedom. Emphasis on the hero with Thatcher if you know what I mean. Roosevelt and his administration I’ll grant you conditionally, aside from racism in the New Deal, ignoring the Holocaust, denying European Jews access to the United States, Executive Order 9066 that interned Japanese-Americans on the West Coast, etc. But he qualifies as a defender of freedom in that he led the United States through most of the second World War and did a lot to bring down Nazi Germany and imperial Japan. Mistakes were made, but challenges also met.

I could say much the same about Churchill. His actions while in the Imperial office, unleashing the Black and Tans on Ireland, and in negotiating the 1921 Treaty with Ireland significantly limited the freedom of subject peoples. But for two years, he and Britain stood alone against Germany. Like Roosevelt in the U.S., he led Britain through the second World War and also did a lot to bring down Nazi Germany.


Posted by Mike on 05/30/03 at 06:41 PM
Just So You KnowPermalink

On Politics

Partisan Politics

I thought of something smart to say, and it’s pithy, too!

Liberals are sanctimonious, and conservatives are condescending.

Too bad for both of ‘em, I say.

[moreover] Present company excepted, needless to say. I’m thinking of Chomsky, Moore, Coulter, and O’Reilly, among many others.


Posted by Johno on 05/30/03 at 06:36 PM
Partisan PoliticsPermalink

Taxes

Filthy Lucre

Johno, I agree that the sending rebate checks is fairly ridiculous. But probably not for the same reason. While a rebate check sent to every tax payer might provide a transitory boost to the economy, it is at best a short term solution. The way to effect the economy with tax cuts is to, well, cut taxes. When people know that their taxes are lower, then they will change their behavior in a way that could effect the economy. This applies to regular income taxes, which might affect consumer confidence, consumer spending, housing starts and the like. Lowering, permanently, dividend taxes and capital gains taxes would increase investment and capital development. It has been shown that lowering taxes increases revenue - because the larger economy that is spurred by lower taxes yields more money in absolute terms, even though percentage of the government’s take of the total economy is smaller. These rebates will not have this effect, because people - individuals and businesses - have no confidence that taxes will remain low. The economic picture is indeed muddled. Lowering tax rates would be a solid thing that people could count on.


Posted by Buckethead on 05/30/03 at 06:35 PM
Filthy LucrePermalink
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